Monday, September 19, 2011

The End

How about a post about Seven?  I have entered Seven into her first agility trial at the end of October.  I continue to have issues with her popping out of the weave poles early.  My agility trainer suggested I offset the last two poles making the ending more difficult than if they were in line.  The idea is that this will make her have to concentrate and work hard to get the last two poles.  I can use a clicker to mark her grand effort in getting the last two poles.
Seven did really well with four and six poles, but eight was another story.  My biggest worry is that we will be in a trial and she simply refuses to weave correctly.  So another strategy I will start to employ in training (so I can use at a trial) is that she gets three attempts and if she is still wrong, I say "sorry" and put her away for awhile.  We got to practice this a few times while working on the last two poles being out of line.
Hopefully, we will get it consistently right one of these days.

19 comments:

Maria Peters said...

Love the "sorry". It's like "ehhhh. Incorrect".

I like big butts! LOL!

houndstooth said...

I think you have some great ideas for improving her efforts. I think she'll get there, too, but I know it's frustrating when you keep working on something and can't quite get it!

Apex Agility Greyhounds said...

Can't wait to see videos from Seven's first trial! I really don't know much about teaching weaves because we've barely gotten to them, but it seems like you tend to always run on the same side of the poles and that's the side she always seems to pop out of. Does it make a difference if you run on the other side of the poles, or does that just make her pop out on the other side?

Cat said...

"sorry"; the anti-clicker. :) Matisse and I used "try again" as an anti-clicker, for a different problem. She would start throwing behaviors (usually with the recall) in the ring after I didn't respond to her while I was waiting for the judge to instruct me to do the next thing. After a moment's pause, she'd toss her head, down, sit, spin, down again :) Anti-clicker cleared it right up, if you don't hear it, you're doing just great with what you're giving me. Hope the "sorry" helps Seven think it through!

Never Say Never Greyhounds said...

Thanks everyone. Apex, you need to be able to do the weaves from both sides. Generally, dog on your right side is considered harder. You'll see me on that side over and over if we are having an issue... which we were. I wanted her to get it right before I did it differently. But otherwise I try to keep it even.

Ximena said...

I know you're like pro at this so don't take my novice advice as anything other than novice advice. I probably have no clue what i'm talking about.

I can't tell -- due to angle of the camera -- if you might even be getting out in front of her so she's over-correcting and skipping the last few weaves to be at your side, but I know it can be an issue for some people. I noticed that sometimes it doesn't matter if you're in line with her or not (because she gets all the weaves right), but the next time it does and she skips the last two.

Anyway -- that may or may not be the case, as I said, I'm nooby in comparison ;). But I hope using an NRM will help!

Pepper said...

I'm also not at all an expert but to my eye she's popping out to come to you, as thats where her reward is - notice you reward her off to the side of the weaves? Perhaps change your reward to being "in line" with the weaves ie: directly in front of the last pole. This is simlar to training 2x2 where you throw out the toy in line with the poles, encouraging her to think forwards rather than sideways.

Winnie said...

I admire you so much for the work you do.

The lady we met who did Heelwork to Music and Agility with a Greyhound cross said she once started working with a 12-year-old rescue sighthound - so she said with me being a youngster of nine there was plenty of chance for me to make my mark.......Hhhmmm!

Love and licks, Winnie

Never Say Never Greyhounds said...

Ximena, I'm not sure I'm following what you are saying. I'm generally moving parallel to the poles about 4 feet away I would guess.

Pepper, I can't have a reward in front of the weaves at a trial so at some point she has to learn to do without. I still use a target at times, but since I was using a clicker during those sessions, the reward was on me.

Andreja said...

I second Pepper's opinion: I think having a reward in front would be less confusing until you get to 12 poles. In the beginning it looks like she's patterned to jump out after 4 poles and keeping the reward ahead might make the remaining poles more obvious... who knows.

I taught weaves using the channel method with 12 poles right from the start, so I didn't have this exact problem, but when I rewarded Ruby a few times by throwing behind him (so he weaved from right to left and then I threw to the right) he started popping out at 10th pole in anticipation of reward. I think he just needed more experience and I pushed him too soon. After I started throwing the reward ahead again popping out disappeared. So just to be clear: there was no target, the whole problem was with where he *expected* the reward to appear.

KF-in-Georgia said...

I was thinking the same thing as Ximena: It's a little hard to tell with the camera angle at the end because you're out of the frame when Seven pops out, but does she do better if you're not so far ahead of her at the end of the line of poles? At the beginning of each pass down the line, you're moving at about the same forward speed as Seven. At the end of the poles--especially when she pops out--it appears that you're ahead of her, so that maybe she's popping out because she thinks she needs to skip ahead to catch up to you?

At least, that's the thought I had when I first saw the video, and before I saw Ximena's comment. I re-watched the video, and she definitely pops out at least once when you're close to her, but for many of her untimely exits, you're far enough ahead of her that you're out of the video frame so I can't really tell if you're further ahead of her on those runs.

Maybe make sure you have a consistent "waiting point" for her runs for a while. Mark a spot on the ground a couple of yards past the last pole and make sure you stand right there as she finishes each run, at least until she realizes that catching up to you is not actually the goal.

Never Say Never Greyhounds said...

Thanks for all the suggestions. Its kind of hard for me to really address them all. You guys really only see what happen to film and post. Seven can do 12 weave poles just fine if there are 2 guides on the end. But I have to get the guides off. So we are playing around with this per my trainers's suggestion. She was trained with guides and channels. She was trained entrances with 2X2. She needs to be able to weave with me front crossing, rear crossing, moving closer, moving away, etc... none of which I've really bothered to attempt so far. I'm only doing 4, 6, and 8 weave poles in this video in an attempt to make things easier for her while she perfects some things... maybe 8 was pushing it. I'm not pleased with all of the errors she made... way too much practicing the errors in those sessions so I'll make adjustments next time to try and make her more successful. Of my 7 agility greyhounds, her weave poles have been by far the most complicated. Her style was hideous, but she has made a huge improvement and is more than decent now... but they still need some work.

browndogcbr said...

Hi Y'all,

Wow, lots of advise! Good luck there Seven!

Please stop by tomorrow and pick up an award we have for you.

Y'all come by now,
Hawk aka BrownDog

Greyhounds CAN Sit said...

I don't know how long your weaving training goes on for or if this was all taken in the one day. To me Seven seemed to really be losing interest at the finish. Maybe if you just do a couple of weaves at a session (hopefully properly!) for a few days? As you said, she doesn't need any more practice doing them wrong! Truly I've got no idea, lol! Good luck. The end of October is still quite a while away.

jet said...

Hm, I think the 'sorry' is a good I idea for 'Never Satisfied' - hopefully she gets it soon enough.

Andreja said...

Yeah, it's easy to be smart when it's not MY problem ;) I hope you girls get this weave stuff down soon.

jcp said...

You have great problem solving skills Jen. You will get it sorted out soon. Good luck!

greytblackdog said...

I too love the sorry correction. Roxy loves all the celebration more than the food when she works - which is never now. I think Im with the others - when you are far ahead of her she sorta loses her place, like she's looking for you instead of looking straight ahead. Again, I'm no expert. Her hop weaving makes me smile.

Kristin G. said...

I love her happy tail. Keep up the good work and it will pay off. :)